[BBeerme]

On those units where the motor 'communicated with the computer', do you remember if the ECM had the five pin connector or the 16 pin connector?

I had same thing happen with a lennox few weeks ago. it is a communicating system, and carrier infinities are too. some of these systems, the motor talks back to the computer, and if the computer doesn't hear the motor, system shuts down.

On this lennox, uses a signal to run motor that a universal motor will not "see". I could get ac running with a universal motor, since motor did not talk to computer, but no way to shut off condensor fan during defrost. I took a chance and used a trane condensor ecm, and it saw the signal and ran.

Have done this on a communicating unit that the motor was talking, but not running. left the motor in furnace plenum and let the universal run 24/7 (no way to cycle it off tstat)

I have seen some carriers that did not have these motors, so a universal would work. Have seen some guys not figure out to do a work around to get temp cooling/heat.

 

[billygoat22]

on blowers, the four pin. ecm 3.4 or 4 I think? they don't all communicate back to the board/computer though.

The lennox had a (non communicating) pwm signal, but the board was communicating.

 

[pacnw]

I only spent 30 seconds looking but it looks like a standard motor. Supply House dot com has them.

Maybe your normal solid HVAC repair team is not as solid as you had imagined? <g>

https://www.supplyhouse.com/Carrier...8-Frame?utm_source=bingad&utm_medium=sku&utm_campaign=Search_SKU_HVAC_X_Exact_X

 

[pacnw]

Haven't you already posted this thread here a couple days ago? Where did it go?

that user was gaycarguy or something like that.

sure sounds like the exact same question and with the same verbiage.

 

[ga-hvac-tech]

on blowers, the four pin. ecm 3.4 or 4 I think? they don't all communicate back to the board/computer though.

The lennox had a (non communicating) pwm signal, but the board was communicating.

On the 20 SEER AlliedAir units... the condenser fan motor is an VS motor, driven by a PWM signal... runs off the comm board (not the inverter board).

There was a batch of fan motors that leaked water early on... and that would blow the comm board.
After a couple of those repairs... have not seen anymore of them.

Note that the motor had attached leads, not plug in leads.

(AlliedAir is part of Lennox, and the AlliedAir inverter stuff is 're-branded' Lennox Harmony)

 

[BNME8EZ]

On the 20 SEER AlliedAir units... the condenser fan motor is an VS motor, driven by a PWM signal... runs off the comm board (not the inverter board).

There was a batch of fan motors that leaked water early on... and that would blow the comm board.
After a couple of those repairs... have not seen anymore of them.

Note that the motor had attached leads, not plug in leads.

(AlliedAir is part of Lennox, and the AlliedAir inverter stuff is 're-branded' Lennox Harmony)

This brings up another point, a lot of equipment out there are sisters in different dresses, for example Carrier, Bryant, Tempstar. Now they may not use all the same parts, but many cross over so the Carrier part may be 120 days out but the Tempstar distributor has the same part with a different number on it sitting on the shelf.

Sometimes it is not just what to look for but where to look.

 

[Mr Bill]

I can promise you, if I have to wire a fan directly to the primary on the contactor, he will have a running motor and cooling again,and this motor will not have to talk back and forth to anything,
but the contactor. :grin2:

 

[BBeerme]

The bigger problem is whether it has a 5 pin connector (with 4 or 5 wires) or the 16 pin connector. The 5 pin connector is a cake walk. With the 16 pin connector, all bets are off, signal could be anything (even proprietary) and sometimes communicating, which means to get unit online you have to bypass everything. With a couple of safeties in the circuit, it's not that big of a deal, until winter comes along. LOL

EDIT:
I actually got a bit side tracked. I've never seen the 16 pin connector on an outdoor fan motor, just the indoor blower.

 

[Mr Bill]

I actually got a bit side tracked. I've never seen the 16 pin connector on an outdoor fan motor

And I hope we never do.. :grin2:

 

[2sac]

This brings up another point, a lot of equipment out there are sisters in different dresses, for example Carrier, Bryant, Tempstar. Now they may not use all the same parts, but many cross over so the Carrier part may be 120 days out but the Tempstar distributor has the same part with a different number on it sitting on the shelf.

Sometimes it is not just what to look for but where to look.

Trying to find a distributor that can cross over the part#'s to their sister brand is another story.

 

[BNME8EZ]

Trying to find a distributor that can cross over the part#'s to their sister brand is another story.

I think it is more the counter guys willingness to look than the actual distributor. I have seen some counter guys that will just flat out tell you there is no way to do that but then you get another guy and he does it with seemingly no problem. I say seemingly because I have no idea of the hoops he may have had to jump through to get it done.

You would know better about that than me!

When I have done this I usually have done what I can to get the correct part number of the part along with unit model/serial and description so it is not a blind search in the dark.

 

[BBeerme]

Just find a wholesaler that sells those Genteq Evergreen motors. They were designed to cross over to OEM specs, that's what they do. 2sac probably has access to those. Some just call them The Green Motors because it is easy to remember.

 

[slctech]

I am sure there are condensing units that require feedback from the condenser fan motor, but that is rare and few. We never did get the model number of the OPs unit, just a part number. With the model a few things could be verified.

Again, though, being in the open forum with our site rules, we all want to be a hero here, it's in our nature, and we all know what we would do if we were the tech with a customer in the OP's position. But the OP is apparently not responding, yet, and we just are talking amongst ourselves and thinking maybe a PRO thread be started on this scenario?

The other thread with the gaycarguy was closed, well one, he was very rude, and everything was going in one ear and right out his butt hole, but still no different here, we are straddling that gray line here with part sourcing, part crossing, and pushing the tech assist envelope.

 

[slctech]

If we got smacked with two people within a few days struggling with the same issue, we can multiply that by a hundred to a thousand that are currently getting the same news from their service guy, nationwide right now. Of those souls, hypothetically, 40% are just going to roll with the heat and wait it out, whereas 60% are searching the internet and this thread is probably a number one search hit. Thus, we have that number of folks, reading what we would do, and they not knowing much about why we would do what we would do, and are then searching PSC motor, contactor, green motor, and heading down a DIY worm hole that more than likely is going to turn out with very unsatisfactory results, for countless reasons.


Just how I see threads like this needing to be slowed down and kept fairly vague or simply closed and things moved to PRO....judty my 2 cents.

 

[ga-hvac-tech]

Sometimes... the supply house is more important than the brand... grin

 

[2sac]

Sometimes... the supply house is more important than the brand... grin

And the question the literally just popped into my mind not 5 minutes ago is "Why should I care? No one else does." Just posted in the what did you work on thread. I'm pulling my hair out trying to get things right for a customer and no one seems to care but myself and the customer. There is no urgency form many of these vendors. I'm winding down now, along with my blood pressure but, spent hours trying to track down a compressor that was supposed to ship on Monday.

 

[ga-hvac-tech]

And the question the literally just popped into my mind not 5 minutes ago is "Why should I care? No one else does." Just posted in the what did you work on thread. I'm pulling my hair out trying to get things right for a customer and no one seems to care but myself and the customer. There is no urgency form many of these vendors. I'm winding down now, along with my blood pressure but, spent hours trying to track down a compressor that was supposed to ship on Monday.

Yeah, I hear you...

Getting later in the 'season' here (Atlanta is an AC market)...
Goodman factory stores are OUT of 410 units...
Fergusson and Johnstone behave like the compressor supplier (do not give a sh*t)...
Allied is good stuff if installed correctly...
Some customers (the Utubers) think they know more than I do...

Thinking seriously to take a long weekend... grin

I may well let a few (fussy... LOL) customers go... I really do not care if 100% of them are happy or not.
Every time I let one fussy person go... I get 2-3 more really good customers...
Might be a lesson in that... :cheers:

 

[BNME8EZ]

If we got smacked with two people within a few days struggling with the same issue, we can multiply that by a hundred to a thousand that are currently getting the same news from their service guy, nationwide right now. Of those souls, hypothetically, 40% are just going to roll with the heat and wait it out, whereas 60% are searching the internet and this thread is probably a number one search hit. Thus, we have that number of folks, reading what we would do, and they not knowing much about why we would do what we would do, and are then searching PSC motor, contactor, green motor, and heading down a DIY worm hole that more than likely is going to turn out with very unsatisfactory results, for countless reasons.


Just how I see threads like this needing to be slowed down and kept fairly vague or simply closed and things moved to PRO....judty my 2 cents.

Reminds me, I had a similar situation early summer, had a drive for a VS compressor die from a mouse making a nest around it, so no fault at all about a manufacturer defect.

I called in for the part and got the dreaded 30+ days out. I started thinking about anything I could do to get these people, my customer some cooling for a month.

I came up with an idea but wanted to run it past the FSR to get his opinion on viability. After giving him the scope on the situation, he said give me your number and let me make some calls.

An hour later he calls back, says he has a drive coming and it will be at my door in 2 days.

Turned out he got permission to pull one off a new unit in stock. Apparently he shook the right tree with his calls. When the drive arrived the next day the paperwork was not the way he said it would be for returning the other one when it arrived so he could put the new unit back in working order.

I called and he still had the one he took off, the factory pushed one out the door and they got it before he could get the one he took off shipped.

That is one reason why I use that distributor a lot!

 

[pacnw]

Reminds me, I had a similar situation early summer, had a drive for a VS compressor die from a mouse making a nest around it, so no fault at all about a manufacturer defect.

I called in for the part and got the dreaded 30+ days out. I started thinking about anything I could do to get these people, my customer some cooling for a month.

I came up with an idea but wanted to run it past the FSR to get his opinion on viability. After giving him the scope on the situation, he said give me your number and let me make some calls.

An hour later he calls back, says he has a drive coming and it will be at my door in 2 days.

Turned out he got permission to pull one off a new unit in stock. Apparently he shook the right tree with his calls. When the drive arrived the next day the paperwork was not the way he said it would be for returning the other one when it arrived so he could put the new unit back in working order.

I called and he still had the one he took off, the factory pushed one out the door and they got it before he could get the one he took off shipped.

That is one reason why I use that distributor a lot!

Making personal connections with distributors can be beneficial!!

I have taken the time to remember things they have going on in their personal lives that they share and then ask about them whenever i am in or on the phone. Same with customers, make them feel that you are more than "just the hvac guy".

 

[2sac]

Making personal connections with distributors can be beneficial!!

I have taken the time to remember things they have going on in their personal lives that they share and then ask about them whenever i am in or on the phone. Same with customers, make them feel that you are more than "just the hvac guy".

We appreciate being appreciated. A lot of you may not realize the hoops some of us jump thru, to get your shit correct.