[The Zohan]

I have a Manitowoc ECS041AG that i am trying to get running at the moment, I haven't done any work on Ice Machines before but have a good understanding of how they work.

The machine was replaced and now i have it and want to get it running again, the problem i am having is that by the end of the cycle the water in the sump is just getting cold enough to start making thin ice shells on the evaporator and by the time that happens it goes into harvest and starts the cycle again.

I wasn't sure about what work had been done on it in the past so i have replaced the drier and capillary (same length and ID) and weighed in a fresh charge of 134a, 240grams on nameplate. when the machine starts with this charge in it the suction pressure will start at around 30psi about 1 degreeC SST and by the end of the cycle it will come down to just above 20psi about -4 to -5 SST... to me this seems far too high to be making ice in the cycle time (12 minutes). there is no HP access on compressor so i can't check that unfortunately.

everything else on machine is working as it should water fill solenoid, hot gas solenoid, compressor and condenser fan are all working, it has a mechanical timer that is also functioning ok putting machine through its cycles etc.

any advice or ideas on what to do would be appreciated,
cheers.

 

[UmmScott]

You replaced the drier, why didnt you add a high side tap?

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[The Zohan]

didn't think of it at the time about to put one in now will post what happens

 

[UmmScott]

didn't think of it at the time about to put one in now will post what happens

What refrigerant?

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[The Zohan]

What refrigerant?

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134a

 

[UmmScott]

20 psi is way too high.

Alot of 134a ice machines start at 18 to 20 and end up around 3 to 8 psi.

If you're not getting down below 15 psi id be narrowing down why the suction is high.
Either stuck open HG valve
Flooding TXV...if its a crap tube then that rules out this.
Weak compressor.

Its probably a weak compressor honestly

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[UmmScott]

Only other thing...

You said it was a cap tube. Was it bonded to the suction line? On a cooler or freezer id say its whatever,
But on an ice machine...
If it indeed was bonded to the suction line and there was a diagnosed crap tube issue i would replace the whole suction/cap tube assy.

It does affect the flowrate of the tube and on something as critical as an ice machine id make sure the OEM part is used.
If it was never bonded to the suction line even from the factory then it doesnt matter, but still make sure the OEM size and length is used

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[The Zohan]

Only other thing...

You said it was a cap tube. Was it bonded to the suction line? On a cooler or freezer id say its whatever,
But on an ice machine...
If it indeed was bonded to the suction line and there was a diagnosed crap tube issue i would replace the whole suction/cap tube assy.

It does affect the flowrate of the tube and on something as critical as an ice machine id make sure the OEM part is used.
If it was never bonded to the suction line even from the factory then it doesnt matter, but still make sure the OEM size and length is used

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it is a cap tube and i have replaced it.. it was bonded to a suction accumulator which i have done with the new one it is run exactly the same way, i have it running again now with the hp gauge on and i am running 180psi head and 25psi on the suction too high on both sides i think i might replace the hot gas solenoid i have been playing around with a magnet and hitting it... every now and then the suction will pump down lower below 20 so could possibly not be seating properly,
also when its running i have seen the suction spike up to 40psi and come back down momentarily so might be a good start?

 

[UmmScott]

Is the condenser clean? Fan going the right way? Not overcharged?
Head pressure is kinda high.

Normally an open hot gas valve would cause high suction and low head.
But....a slightly leaky valve..idk

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[TechmanTerry]

Thats a lot of work and little to show for it.

 

[The Zohan]

Thats a lot of work and little to show for it.

sure is I'm putting it down to the comp i just crimped off the hot gas valve and no change in suction pressure... Thanks for the info UmmScott

 

[itsiceman]

http://www.iceparts.com/literature/Manitowoc/EC_Tech_English.pdf

 

[trippintl0]

I bet it's overcharged. Try pinching off SUCTION line and see if that little compressor can pump into a vacuum.

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[The Zohan]

I bet it's overcharged. Try pinching off SUCTION line and see if that little compressor can pump into a vacuum.

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tried dropping out small amounts of gas to get the suction down to where it needs to be still won't do it.

 

[trippintl0]

tried dropping out small amounts of gas to get the suction down to where it needs to be still won't do it.

Well prob a weak compressor then.

I personally have found it very easy to overcharge the little 5oz ice machines - the SMS50 shotglass style cubers.

The difference between purging your hose with vapor vs liquid will make the ice machine either make perfect full cubes in 17min vs make little slivers in 30 min if you purge with liquid (which puts an extra 2 oz or so of charge in the machine).

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[The Zohan]

how do you go about charging a small 8 oz machine?

I weighed in the charge using the liquid tap on the bottle and throttling it through the gauges i also changed out my hoses for copper capillary lines, is there a problem with doing it this way?
I haven't worked on too much critical charge equipment.

 

[The Zohan]

Well prob a weak compressor then.

I personally have found it very easy to overcharge the little 5oz ice machines - the SMS50 shotglass style cubers.

The difference between purging your hose with vapor vs liquid will make the ice machine either make perfect full cubes in 17min vs make little slivers in 30 min if you purge with liquid (which puts an extra 2 oz or so of charge in the machine).

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Also what methods can you use on a capillary system to determine whether the charge is ok or not apart from the obvious, its working.

 

[TechmanTerry]

What is SH at the comp and what is the comp discharge line temp?

 

[The Zohan]

What is SH at the comp and what is the comp discharge line temp?

not looking at it right now.... might revisit it another day, but for now it has gotten the better of me.

 

[itsiceman]

Stop pinching 5hit

You can charge 134a as a vapor so don't invert the tank

RTFM...........

..............Troubleshoot the premature harvest with some basic hand tools!!