[username1]

Has anybody every done this? I just installed my first very minisplit in my personal home about a month ago and it wasn't too difficult so this next project peaks my curiousity. My current problem is that I have a restaurant that's panera bread style that uses 2 flattop grills, a bread oven, 2 massive green egg grills. There is 2 massive exhaust hoods, one is pulling hot air out so that's good and another is pulling cold air out because it's pulling too much ( I can slow it down but I'm not at that step yet and yes I understand the positive / negative airflow would be slightly off).
The store currently uses five 5 tons gas packs, 3 in the serving area and 2 in the back. The rear 5 ton is serving the non-kitchen back area of store (washing, cooler, office). The kitchen 5 ton is split between a hallway and the kitchen itself so I'm guessing the kitchen itself is only getting 2.5 tons tops. The ceilings are about 10 ft high so you can barely feel the cool air.
The main concern with management is that the true dressers are holding the food at 60 degrees on the surface ( the inside is holding 40-45 but they have these things packed massively), I personally feel bad for the employees. This is located in South Carolina so it's hot!!!
Unfortunately I am a 1-2 man crew so I don't have the capacity to install a new RTU in the roof and rerouting duct work isn't an option as it would steal air from other spaces. 4 thermostats read 70-72's where the kitchen is 81-82. Given my situation, is installing 2 individual minisplit heads a plausible idea? I'm torn between two 1 Ton heads vs two 2 heads? I'm thinking probably with two 2 ton's. And sorry to disappoint, I'm only 23 so I haven't gotten to load calculations in my career yet. I've looked into the ceiling tile style ventilators but I personally believe the ceiling is too high to make any real difference to the food or employees.
Someone also told me that Dhec may not allow it, is that true or is this more of a myth? There are no fryers around so grease isn't a problem and the drain will be properly drained away with pvc or copper.

Units are Daikin FTK12NMVJU / RK12NMVJU (EVAP/COND) 1 TON
OR Daikin FTK24NMVJU / RK24NMVJU 2 TON.
United Refrigeration do not carry Mitsubishi or Fuji (whatever that brand is) ( I do have the catalog so if you have any other models, I can look at it)
Please advice and thanks in advance

 

[vargimike]

Commercial kitchens are a a *****. I get equipment sales rep to do loads. just to many factors and time for me to deal with. Just off the top of my head two tons isnt even close to how much you need. 23 and starting out good for you brother.

 

[stat]

If they cook food there, it will be greasy. I would not put a mini split in a kitchen.

 

[Roncool]

Has anybody every done this? I just installed my first very mini-split in my personal home about a month ago and it wasn't too difficult so this next project peaks my curiosity. My current problem is that I have a restaurant that's Panera bread style that uses 2 flattop grills, a bread oven, 2 massive green egg grills. There is 2 massive exhaust hoods, one is pulling hot air out so that's good and another is pulling cold air out because it's pulling too much ( I can slow it down but I'm not at that step yet and yes I understand the positive / negative airflow would be slightly off).
The store currently uses five 5 tons gas packs, 3 in the serving area and 2 in the back. The rear 5 ton is serving the non-kitchen back area of store (washing, cooler, office). The kitchen 5 ton is split between a hallway and the kitchen itself so I'm guessing the kitchen itself is only getting 2.5 tons tops. The ceilings are about 10 ft high so you can barely feel the cool air.
The main concern with management is that the true dressers are holding the food at 60 degrees on the surface ( the inside is holding 40-45 but they have these things packed massively), I personally feel bad for the employees. This is located in South Carolina so it's hot!!!
Unfortunately I am a 1-2 man crew so I don't have the capacity to install a new RTU in the roof and rerouting duct work isn't an option as it would steal air from other spaces. 4 thermostats read 70-72's where the kitchen is 81-82. Given my situation, is installing 2 individual mini split heads a plausible idea? I'm torn between two 1 Ton heads vs two 2 heads? I'm thinking probably with two 2 ton's. And sorry to disappoint, I'm only 23 so I haven't gotten to load calculations in my career yet. I've looked into the ceiling tile style ventilators but I personally believe the ceiling is too high to make any real difference to the food or employees.
Someone also told me that Dhec may not allow it, is that true or is this more of a myth? There are no fryers around so grease isn't a problem and the drain will be properly drained away with pvc or copper.

Units are Daikin FTK12NMVJU / RK12NMVJU (EVAP/COND) 1 TON
OR Daikin FTK24NMVJU / RK24NMVJU 2 TON.
United Refrigeration do not carry Mitsubishi or Fuji (whatever that brand is) ( I do have the catalog so if you have any other models, I can look at it)
Please advice and thanks in advance

I know this depends on your area however in most cases in a kitchen they use coolers and use air intakes to make up for the hoods that are sucking out air. If you are coretly replacing displaced air with roof air or cooler air there should not be a positive or neg air flow problem. The problem is the heat these ovens put off , especially that area. I own a restaurant I installed a mini split in kitchen and it's worked out very nice. Keeping a other wise hot kitchen cool or cooler. The positives is no duct loss . It does need to be spot cooling more in a area close to user area . A open high area will just add to heat load. Remember cool air tends to fall and heat rise. so placement is important. It can work well and in a normal kitchen environment grease is not the problem .

 

[username1]

1. Well that's why I was starting to think that 4 tons is what'll be needed.
2. You're right, there will be grease but Sonic / Zaxbys grease is hell of a lot different than grease from flatops grills vs fryers
3. In all my restaurants, we use make up and exhaust hoods. Due to lack of AC and piss poor duct work in most, a lot of times I'll slow the exhaust belt down to reduce the amount of air being pulled out which helps a lot in keeping the AC in. Due to the kitchen being a long rectangluar (7x20), I can only put it on one wall which would be 7-8 ft high on 10 - 12 ft ceilings. This is why I was thinking about adding 2 individual heads to spread the air around

Besides adding mini splits and slowing exhaust hoods, I don't really see how to add cool air and or remove the heat w/o taking the currently AC air out as well. Any ideas?

 

[Metalman0880]

You say there is two exhaust hoods? One pulling hot air and one pulling cold air because it's to much cold air? It's not clear how your trying to describe this?? First of all if you have exhaust you should have make up. You could always do conditioned make up? Honestly I'm confused. You want more cooling but say your sucking cold air out because it's to much? Why not just slow it down and ad make up air. Usually when hoods are installed with exhaust a calc is done for btu and cfm. Then equal for make up air. You have 25 ton of cooling. How big is the space? Windows facing what direction? Occupant capacity? Where is the kitchen/hood? Is it in the back segregated from the eating area? Do we even have numbers for the hood? Dump hot water on a flat grill to produce steam. See how fast it's drafting. Lots of questions.


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[jnsrose]

I have put Mini splits in Kitchens. You need to know going in that they will require more maintenance than usual. Also the heat load will usually keep them going all day and night. As far as sizing goes I don't care how old you are you either know how to do it or you find someone who does. I will say make sure you have an understanding of what the customer wants. Wired non wired remote etc. Good luck.

 

[username1]

I am on my phone so there may be a few spelling errors. The place is a former Panera bread restaurant. It's hold the same layout except they added another exhaust hood. Each hood has make up air. Both are captive air. They were balanced by captive aire in January when the restaurant opened. When I mean by pulling cold air, I mean that the 'big green eggs charcoal grills' are not producing enough heat and therefore the hood is pulling more AC air than the actual heat load. Whereas its brother hood next to it, is warm because it's pulling the actual heat load.
Right now the customer thinks buying new dressers stations will solve the issue when I clearly know I need to bring ambient temp down before buying new dressers. Because the AC vents are so high up and are only supplying 2.5 tons top, slowing the hood down isn't going to fix it. I need to bring air in or find a way to condition it. Does captive air actually make conditioned make up air or do I need to configure it in a way it'll be conditioned? My labor rates is probably 1/2 compared to 90% of you on here and if the customer is still hesitant to proceed, some things cannot be up to the standards some of y'all have even if I agree with y'all. That's why I am asking for extra opinions. I'm doing this for the employees sweating their a$$ off and for the food that isn't making temp. To metal man, i already described the layout of it. No windows, about 7 ft from the back of the exhaust hoods to the back of the true dressers and about 20-25ft length. Lots of heat by the grills next to the dresser stations.

 

[username1]

Background: I keep and maintain the same 15-20 restaurant and fix anything from fryers, ice machines, AC, plumbing, etc. 95% of my RTUs are either 5 ton or 7.5. Always and only those two. I have never needed to do a load calc as I don't do new install except replacing RTU and curbs. If someone can tell me how to do a load calc or give me documents to, then I'll be happy to try and do one. Thanks again for the help

 

[eastwoodisme]

I have a 384 Square Foot Shaved Ice stand with a single Mini Split unit in the kitchen. The A/C is plenty big for the square footage but of course does not circulate the air all the way around the stand. I installed an inline fan and custom duct work in the attic that works as a return air system. It removes hot air that has stratified above the freezer and dumps it into the top of the Mini Split to recirculate and recondition it. It works amazingly well. I hope this helps!

I have to have 7 posts before I can post links got to tinypic .com /a/fkxxd1/3

 

[pecmsg]

400 Sq Ft and you can’t circ air?
That’s decently the wrong equipment for the application

 

[eastwoodisme]

400 Sq Ft and you can’t circ air?
That’s decently the wrong equipment for the application

Though walls? Nah. A mini split can't circulate air through walls.

 

[timebuilder]

I have a 384 Square Foot Shaved Ice stand with a single Mini Split unit in the kitchen. The A/C is plenty big for the square footage but of course does not circulate the air all the way around the stand. I installed an inline fan and custom duct work in the attic that works as a return air system. It removes hot air that has stratified above the freezer and dumps it into the top of the Mini Split to recirculate and recondition it. It works amazingly well. I hope this helps!

I have to have 7 posts before I can post links got to tinypic .com /a/fkxxd1/3

Please do not post in old threads. Thanks.

Start your own thread that address your issue.

 

[timebuilder]

Though walls? Nah. A mini split can't circulate air through walls.

It would also become gummed up very quickly, and difficult to clean, because you would need to have access to the unit down to the floor with nothing on that wall.

 

[eastwoodisme]

Please do not post in old threads. Thanks.

Start your own thread that address your issue.

I was posting a response to the OPs unsolved issue. I didn't have an issue to post?

 

[eastwoodisme]

It would also become gummed up very quickly, and difficult to clean, because you would need to have access to the unit down to the floor with nothing on that wall.

How do you mean? We clean it from the top...

 

[timebuilder]

I was posting a response to the OPs unsolved issue. I didn't have an issue to post?

The OP started the thread a year and a half ago. That's a thread that is old.

 

[timebuilder]

How do you mean? We clean it from the top...

Typically, you need to access a mini on a ladder, and very few kitchens have room against a wall for that ladder.