Call a tech. I don't do ice machines but i can say with confidence that 130 psi suction is far too high.

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You have no clue as to what you are looking at. Call a tech or just buy another unit.

 

Here is a hint.... the low side pressure should coincide with evaporator temperature.
30 psi seems a little high to me for 134 and end of cycle ice sheet.
This isn't automotive where the compressor cycles with pressure switches.
Charge is critical.
And frankly when it comes to ice machines charge is the last thing I check on a service call

 

Also if you used automotive gauges on it you likely contaminated it.

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I personally thought 130 seemed high myself... 20-30 does seem to be "where it should be".

Like I said.. I work around automotive HVAC all the time, but am not a professional by any means. However - BOTH the stickers on the machine AND the service manual specifically stated 130.

The 5 oz I put in the machine was very carefully metered - trust me. I also pulled the refrigerant completely out (yes, I have a recovery system) and did a from-the-start static charge of exactly 12oz (as specified by the service manual). No difference.

So.. I also tig-welded the line between the evap and HG valve shut.. just to test if the HG valve was leaking.. It does not seem to change things much. Removed the temp-seal and put the line back to normal, so...

Regarding the "no idea what you are looking at" and "call a pro" comments... I came here for technical advice, not the condescending type. ALTHOUGH - I do appreciate the "professional" manner of that advice. I was not aware this board was reserved for seasoned HVAC techs.

Considering I am a software engineer with cluster-management utilities running on supercomputers over at the NASA Goddard flight center... I am not your typical homeowner. Besides... I likely have more fabrication and service tooling in my home workshop than most "professional HVAC" guys. Only lack the experience when it comes to HVAC-related issues.

I got this practically given to me and just wanted to use it out in the man cave... just seems the last one I had was WAY faster (like less than 20 minutes) at making ice and that the evap/ice tray got so much colder.

BESIDES the technical aspect of this... How fast are these at making ice in your experience? At the end of the day, I suppose finding another on CL for $150 is just easier than messing around with this one...

..but I do love being challenged to make something work.

 

You need to understand that the pressures showing on the machine tag are system TEST pressures.
That's what makes it obvious you have no clue what you are doing. I.E. dont go ABOVE 130 psi on the low side.
If the unit is operating and you see anything above say 35 psi on the low side you got big problems ( unless it's harvesting)
If anywhere else in the system you see above 185 you also have big problems.
As I stated earlier charge is CRITICAL. That means if you suspect low charge you recover and weigh it. THAT'S THE ONLY WAY.

 

Contaminated??

Contaminated... how so?

My manifold set is very clean. What could contaminate this system from an automotive one? The r134a comes out of the same 30lb canister.. unless you guys use a different quality/grade 30lb canister from the one sold at Autozone? I don't work on old civics here... only cars I usually touch are well-maintained BMW and Benz models (usually newer). Most auto systems I have ever worked on have been un-touched since factory.

No, really... I am seriously curious now. Someone care to chime in?

 

My understanding is that PAG oil is not compatible with hermetic compressors. If i remember correctly it is electrically conductive and could short out the compressor.

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Ok so automotive uses PAG oil vs. your machine which uses POE.
Wait there's more ....
I see now these guys have beat me to it on two points, oil & test pressure.

 

Yes automotive refrigerant cylinders are the same R134a gas as stationary equipment. The difference being the connection. If you weighed in the charge amount correctly you can continue to diagnose from there.

 

Well.. Then I likely contaminated it. Lol..

That's good to know. I do know many hybrids specify a different oil (probably for the same reason).. but any mechanic I have ever known usually uses the same manifold set for them (electric compressors as well).

I try not to let the stuff pool up in my manifold set anyway, but glad that was pointed out.

 

Don't worry about it and move on with your repair.

 

Recovered and charged exactly 12oz..

Just does not seem that cold. And low side stays around 10-15psi with the factory specified charge. Ambient temp in the room is around 65.. I will break out the temp gun and get some readings off the evap.

I suppose the normal temp charts come into play here. Just not sure if they were the same for automotive... Like I said, not a pro here. Only thing I got of any formality in HVAC is the 609 cert so I could buy the cylinders years back when I owned my automotive business.

More importantly... the non-technical question prevails.. Anyone with one of these "under the counter" style machines have any experience and know in the ballpark about how much ice they normally make in an hour? The manual for this one states only that a cycle lasts about 20 minutes. But the ice is not always "ready" during each cycle. Yet, it starts the harvest cycle sometimes when it is not even half-ready.

Again, many thanks in advance here guys. And thanks for your patience.

 

10-15 sounds close depending on the part of the cycle. Not familiar with this particular model or make but really they all work the same way.
Has the unit been running for days? Because they are engineered to have the cold of a full bin of ice.....
Can't just plug it in and expect a sheet every 20 minutes.
How is water flow over evaporator? What temperature is incoming water?
Really this unit should harvest based on the low pressure switch

 

.

 

@ 50 lbs. per day I did 50÷24 to get a per hour weight.

 

Leaking hot gas valve would have the outlet of the valve warm from the hot gas. Not frosty


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The 20-25psi sounded high to me. Most r134a undercounter ice machines I've serviced run 7-10psi at start of freeze, closer to 0 right before harvest. I was thinking overcharged, weak compressor, or leaking HGV if production is truly low. A quick catch of a batch of ice weighed out will tell. Pinch off tool easily rules out HGV leaking by.

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One post says 7oz of 134a and another post says 12oz.

 

The frost on the outlet is not a tell. If the temp of the inlet side is the same as the discharge line would it would be a good indicator of bypass.

Doesn't "autozone" gas come with oil and or leak sealant in the tank?

Is ice fully forming over the entire evaporator?

 

My wife and kid got email from one person going strait to trash and they need it to show up in the inbox. What's wrong?

 

Dean

There is NO gauge access! It is a "Sealed System" How did you recover and recharge?

 

Come on man...
He's got a TIG welder!

 

Yes, this unit came (to me) with a schrader valve already installed. Comes directly off the compressor. Looks factory, honestly.

I have a small robin air recovery system.

Yeah... I tig welded it because - although I DO have an oxy setup, I do NOT have the proper brazing rods for correct HVAC work. Light gauge copper wire works great for filler . Not the most practical for daily professional repairmen, but effective and works.

Nope, normal 134a from a 30 lb cylinder. No oil, no additives.. nada.

Ice is fully forming... sometimes. Left it running over night and:

Sometimes it produced (give or take) a couple pounds an hour... sometimes it seems to run and produce a couple half-formed "shells" around the evap. The temp is consistent across the evap (inlet/outlet) based on the formation of the ice, but it is like it went through a half-cycle or.. ice is largely hollow.

So, all the temps seem to be within roughly 10-15% of the temp chart. Just strange that sometimes it is technically fine, and other times (when I basically am not around)... it works like crap. It is the inconsistency that started me down this road with the thing. I am getting the feeling that the mechanical portion of this may be fine, just something with the control side and cycle control. The electronic controls: now this is something I would need no help with I did plenty of microcontroller programming and electronic work back in early 2000's.

But meh.. already found another one on CL new-in-box for $300 (whirlpool). Never opened, purchased for remodel that never happened. I already got enough projects on my hand - of which I a AM more than competent in handling without help - to keep me plenty busy. Probably not worth the collective time that has already been spent here. Especially for "itsiceman". That guy was clearly busy with an HVAC call at 5:20 this morning.

 

Of all the refrigeration pieces in restaurants ... Ice Machines are by far the most difficult to work on

You are jumping right in the alligator pit ...

 

If you are using automotive hoses ... arent they like 5 feet long ?

Hell there goes 3 oz just in the hose which makes it guesstimating how much you actually dumped in , and Ice Machines dont have a very good sense of humor

 

I usually account for 2oz lost in the gauge.

Sorry about the measurement confusion, too..

It is 7oz. Don't know why I typed the other numbers last night.

My ex-wife did not have much of a sense of humor either...

Just that much more of a reason I am buying the other one. Plenty of other ice makers out there...