geez, will there be anything left after filing?

 

I know you are kidding, but it is a teachable moment for others.

When it's that bad, you really can't fix it. You're talking about replacing components on a massive scale.

Because there was a higher resistance at those contacts, they acted like heaters, and that's why those parts got eaten away that way.

If you try to file or grind those stubs, you will reduce the part dimension so much that the clamping force will be less than intended, and you'll be back at square one again soon.

 

What on earth are you talking about? What massive scale? Those three stabs are held onto the main bus with a couple of small screws. Then you put in a new breaker. Done.

As I said in the original post, I took more pause with the breaker directly below, all of that metal debris falling into that electrical. But it is a simple matter to clean that. Once the main for the building is off, just get the R-12 and once you pull that breaker, blow out the metal dust.

When it's that bad, you really can't fix it. You're talking about replacing components on a massive scale.

 

Maybe I need to see better pictures, but when I see that level of damage I know that the associated piece, in this case the bus, is also similarly damaged.

In that case, no, you wouldn't just install new breakers and put it back together again.

 

I didn't say you just install a new breaker. You also need to replace the stabs that are bolted to the bus. Those things the breaker draws its power from.

It may only be a 4 or 500 amp panel, but the buss's are a pretty good heat sink. It would take a LOT of heat to damage those. Most likely more heat than what the breaker would allow before tripping.

 

If you can post additional pictures, maybe we won't even have a disagreement...

 

That does not look like your typical breaker / buss design. I have never seen such a breaker. What is the equipment it protects ?

 

Five ton condensing unit for walk in cooler.

That does not look like your typical breaker / buss design. I have never seen such a breaker. What is the equipment it protects ?

 

.........
The scary part was all of the debris sitting on the breaker below.

To me the "scary part" is the 100 amp rating on a stab lok type breaker!!!

How many amps was that circuit handling?
How do you prevent a re-occurrence?

 

The breaker was 40 amps. The compressor drew about 15. Add the CFM and evap fans and you are still well within limits.

My suspicion is that the the night time guys have been turning that breaker off at night when they load the box. Every night for who knows how long. I'm guessing that because there is a switch in the walk in (that probably used to turn off the fans for the evaps) saying that it is disabled and to use the breaker. I'm a real Sherlock Holmes! [LOL]

The switch was likely originally disabled because of repeated ice ups on the evaps. Just a guess. The liquid line solenoid is at the condensing unit, and I would bet five bucks to a doughnut that the installer did not run a circuit tying that switch to the solenoid to pump down when the fans were shut down.

And yes, give it time, and I'd also bet good money the problem will re-occur.

To me the "scary part" is the 100 amp rating on a stab lok type breaker!!!

How many amps was that circuit handling?
How do you prevent a re-occurrence?

 

Please, tell me that that's not a Federal Pacific breaker.....

 

Heh heh, no. Some weird off the wall panel though. Think I've seen the label a few times through the years. But certainly not Square D, GE or anything else common.

 

I am with TB on that also i would take 2 steps back and call sparky. My electrical license would not allow me to touch that, and i would not want the liability of having any part of. There is probably more issues than just that in that panel.:eek2:

 

Bingo. I did call a sparky. But not for the reasons you cite or may think.

That particular site is a customer that gives us a lot of work. And therefor, by contract, we give them them an exceptional rate on labor. So you see, the money for that account (as anyone knows with refrigeration) is in the parts. The only real part was a circuit breaker.

I kicked it to the 'next level' because to incur liability for all of the electrical in that store, which also means computers, cash registers, and all other HVACR, would be senseless for the profit off of one simple breaker.

Legally or code wise, there is no problem for me to complete the repair. And I am quite familiar with what is going on and the signs to look for that indicate other problems. I just didn't want the company I work for to have that phone call saying "you didn't shut down things right, so you owe us a new computer system".

 

One of the most relevant aspects of what we've seen, is that any device which has had its terminations exposed to that level of overheating should never be filed, ground, or considered for any type of use in the future.

 

Duh.

I thought you (and the others reading this thread) were intelligent enough and would have figured out the sarcasm of the thread title by now.

HINT:
The give away clue is that there would be no metal left after filing or grinding down.

 

As far as commercial main panels go, I personally prefer bolt in type breakers.

 

That's a good approach. The only issue is arranging a convenient time to power down the panel for the work. I usually opt for early morning, before the business opens.

 

I think it is wise to let someone else assume that liability. That breaker is toast.

 

Looks like Zinco breakers. Worst breaker's I have worked with. They don't make good contact so they over heat and start sparking and fizzing.

 

For the life of me, I can't remember the name of the panel.

Typically, there will be more than one manufacturer of breakers for a panel. Due to knock offs, aftermarket, or buyouts.

I just didn't see any money in the job for us. So I passed it off to sparky.

Ironically, there was someone in corporate that saw I passed it off to another, and they shot off emails saying I should have called our sparky. I sent him an email trying to explain the potential minimal profit Vs the possible damage claim to other expensive equipment. He never responded, so I'm guessing he thought about it and came to the same correct decision I did.

 

I had the first, but missed the sarcasm part.

 

Should I use a file or angle grinder to touch up this electrical, LOL.

I think the sarcasm was in the first line.

 

Should I use a file or angle grinder to touch up this electrical, LOL.

I think the sarcasm was in the first line.

Yup. It was pretty obvious. At least if you can read and your comprehension is at a minimum normal. If someone chooses not to actually read the posts, then no amount of 'providing the most perspective possible' or good intentions will make any difference.

Remember, no matter how hard you try, you just can't fix stupid.